Skip to main content

Relationship between jhānas and stream entry, and ridiculous Vism. theory of 5 hindrances matching 5 jhāna factors

 


Re: Relationship between jhanas and stream entry

Post by frank k » 

dpcalder wrote: ↑Fri Dec 23, 2022 8:53 amI’ve heard some conflicting opinions on this

Are the jhanas necessary for stream entry? Are there differing opinions on this?

I am also curious if anyone can help me better understand the relationship between the jhana factors and suppression of the five hindrances.

It is my understanding that each jhana factor suppresses a certain hindrance. Is this suppression total eradication or just temporary?
You're getting wrong ideas from Vism. and LBT Theravada.
The whole 5 jhāna factor matched up with a perfect soul mate in one of the 5 hindrances is idiotic and corrupt, doesn't come from the suttas.
Even in the Vism. where it talks about that, Buddhaghosa claims that hindrance soul mate matching comes from one of the KN treatises, and the translator Nanamoli adds a footnote ("no it doesn't"), meaning he can't find it in KN where Buddhaghosa says it comes from.

Just use some common sense. Ekaggata for example, would be enough to counter any of the 5 hindrances, not just one of them.

As to your real question on the relation between jhāna and stream entry, if you're following Vism. and LBT, then I have nothing to say, other than you're in for a world of pain and confusion.

But if you're interested in the EBT suttas, no need to worry about this question. Because jhāna is indispensable and absolutey necesssary for arahantship, and there's a quite a range of quality in both jhāna and stream entry. For example, there was the drunkard in SN 55 who other followers doubted being a stream enterer, but the Buddha said he was.

The only way you'd know for sure if you're a stream enterer anyway, is if you develop your jhāna and psychic powers to the extent that you could see how many lives left before you become an arahant.

Otherwise, whether you believe you're a stream enterer is mostly based on a flimsy checklist of indefinite qualities the suttas says are necessary, or faith in someone who you believe is an arahant claiming you're a stream enterer.


Comments

Post a Comment

Popular posts from this blog

Advice to younger meditators on jhāna, sex, porn, masturbation

Someone asked: Is porn considered harmful sexual.activity? I don't have a sex life because I don't have a partner and I don't wish to engage in casual sex so I use porn to quench the biological urge to orgasm. I can't see that's it's harmful because nobody is being forced into it. The actors are all paid well and claim to enjoy it etc. The only harm I can see is that it's so accessible these days on smart devices and so children may access it but I believe that this is the parents responsibility to not allow unsupervised use of devices etc. Views? Frankk response: In another thread, you asked about pleasant sensations and jhāna.  I'm guessing you're young, so here's some important advice you won't get from suttas   if you're serious about jhāna.  (since monastics are already celibate by rule)   If you want to attain stable and higher jhānas,   celibacy and noble silence to the best of your ability are the feedstock and prerequiste to tha
Post a Comment
Read more

SN 48.40 Ven. Thanissaro comments on Ven. Sunyo's analysis

This was Ven. Sunyo's analysis of SN 48.40: https://notesonthedhamma.blogspot.com/2024/05/exciting-news-honest-ebt-scholars-like.html And here is Ven. Thanissaro's response to that analysis: I think there’s a better way to tackle the issue of SN 48:40 than by appealing to the oldest layers of commentarial literature. That way is to point out that SN 48:40, as we have it, doesn’t pass the test in DN 16 for determining what’s genuine Dhamma and what’s not. There the standard is, not the authority of the person who’s claiming to report the Buddha’s teachings, but whether the teachings he’s reporting are actually in accordance with the principles of the Dhamma that you know. So the simple fact that those who have passed the Buddha’s teachings down to us say that a particular passage is what the Buddha actually taught is not sufficient grounds for accepting it. In the case of the jhānas—the point at issue here— we have to take as our guide the standard formula for the jhānas, a
Post a Comment
Read more

1min. video: Dalai Lama kissing boy and asking him to suck his tongue

To give more context, this is a public event,  * everyone knows cameras are rolling  *  it's a room full of children * the boy's mom is standing off camera a few feet away watching all of this * the boy initiated contact, he had already had a hug with Dalai Lama earlier and then asked Dalai Lama for another hug which triggered this segment  17 min. video showing what happened before that 1 min. clip and after, with some explanation https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bT0qey5Ts78 16min talk from Ajahn Acalo with his thoughts on Dalai Lama kissing boy, relevance to Bhikkhu monastic code, sexual predators in religion in general, and how celibate monastics deal with sexual energy. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uK2m0TcUib0 The child's comments about the incident in a filmed interview later https://www.marca.com/en/lifestyle/world-news/2023/04/18/643eba5d46163ffc078b457c.html The child: It's a great experience It was amazing to meet His Holiness and I think it's a great ex
Post a Comment
Read more