Wednesday, December 4, 2019

loopable suttas & sutta passages: timeless reminders you never tire of hearing


loopable suttas & sutta passages: timeless reminders you never tire of hearing

Post by frank k » Wed Dec 04, 2019 7:51 am
What are your favorite loopable sutta passages, ones that give profound messages that you could recite over and over again out loud and/or in your mind, for hours at a time, and you never tire of hearing it because it's such a timely reminder of what you should be doing or concerned about right now? They are also great at suppressing and directly developing understanding of how hindrances/defilements arise.

Here are a few of mine:

1. STED right effort, the four aspects, such as in SN 45.8
2. AN 4.14 guarding the sense doors
3. SN 46.2 the first 3 hindrances
4. SN 22.29: one who delights [in each of the 5uk aggregates] delights in dukkha. one who delights in dukkha, is not freed from dukkha.

question: tips for defeating lust

https://www.reddit.com/r/Buddhism/comments/e5g4q7/tips_for_defeating_lust/


Tips for Defeating Lust

So my whole life I’ve struggled with being overly lustful & I’ve been working to beat a porn addiction for a few months now. It’s also just generally difficult with day to day relationships when I can’t help but see many female friends of mine as being “attractive”. It makes it very hard to be mindful in my present moment as well. This isn’t that surprising as I’m a 20 year old man, but I wondered if there are any mindful practices or Buddhist teachings which could help me out!


SN 8.4: Ven. Ananda gives advice to lustful monk
MN 14: pleasures of meditation (once one can do it well) exceeds pleasures of sex
31 body parts meditation

Wednesday, November 27, 2019

B. Sujato's translation of 'situational awareness' for 'sampajano' is inadequate


Re: Situation awareness

Post by frank k » Wed Nov 27, 2019 6:09 am
Dhammanando wrote: 
Mon Nov 25, 2019 10:56 pm

English renderings of sampajañña are of broadly three kinds. The rendering "clear comprehension" (or some synonym of this) is usually used by those translators who accept the Abhidhamma's treatment of sampajañña as a mode of paññā:
It doesn't need Abhidhamma support to justify that interpretation.
AN 4.41 defines sampajano as :
STED S&S💭 definition custom built for in-jhāna usage
Now look in AN 4.41, the 4 developments of samadhi sutta, and once again you see the same definition of sampajano as in SN 47.35, the one that fits jhāna perfectly in terms of the most obvious things one would investigate from such a still and refined state of mind.
AN 4.41 third of four exercises, for sati and sampajaññāya
Katamā ca, bhikkhave, samādhi-bhāvanā bhāvitā bahulīkatā
{and} what, *********, concentration-development, when developed (and) pursued,
Sati-sampajañ-ñāya saṃvattati?
(to) mindfulness-(and)-clear-comprehension (it) leads?
Idha, bhikkhave, bhikkhuno
Here, monks, a-monk:
viditā vedanā uppajjanti,
known (are) feelings (as they) arise,
viditā upaṭṭhahanti,
known (as they are) attended-upon,
viditā abbhatthaṃ gacchanti.
known (as they) go to} disappear.
viditā saññā uppajjanti,
known (are) perceptions (as they) arise,
viditā upaṭṭhahanti,
known (as they are) attended-upon,
viditā abbhatthaṃ gacchanti.
known (as they) go to} disappear.
viditā vitakkā uppajjanti,
known (are) thoughts (as they) arise,
viditā upaṭṭhahanti,
known (as they are) attended-upon,
viditā abbhatthaṃ gacchanti.
known (as they) go to} disappear.
Ayaṃ, bhikkhave, samādhi-bhāvanā bhāvitā bahulīkatā
This, *********, concentration-development, when developed (and) pursued,
Sati-sampajañ-ñāya saṃvattati.
mindfulness-(and)-clear-comprehension (it) leads-to.



That same passage also occurs:

AN 7.38 contains same fragment from AN 4.41
MN 111 is really just a more detailed version of AN 7.38 and AN 4.41
AN 7.39 same as AN 7.38 except talking about Sariputta instead of monk
AN 8.9 S&S definition for Ven. Nanda, same as AN 4.41
DN 33.7 S&S definition same as AN 4.41
MN 111 for four jhanas and first 3 formless attainments
MN 123 marvellous quality of the Tathāgata:
SN 47.35 sati defined as 4sp, sampajano same as AN 4.41
Early Theravada Commentary
KN Paṭis, 1. mahāvaggo, 3. ānāpānas-sati-kathā
MN 18 what he feels, he perceives, thinks (compare to AN 4.41)


So in conclusion, 'situational awareness' is a poor translation for it fails to adequately address the important function of sati and sampajano in 3rd jhana, where 'situational awareness of physical postures, etc.' is a marginal feature at best.

sati simplified, B. Analayo's misinterpretations



https://buddhism.stackexchange.com/questions/36069/simplest-possible-teaching-on-the-four-satipatthana/36079#36079

The best advice I can give anyone, beginner or not, is forget about MN 10 and DN 22 (the suttas people tend to default to as the definitive reference on the subject), and ignore what most of the so called experts are saying about mindfulness. Instead, read the first 10 suttas in SN 47, the satipatthana samyutta, carefully, and repeatedly. Those 10 suttas in SN 47, and you can rely on Thanissaro's excellent book, "right mindfulness" as the best reference manual on the topic, although there are a couple of issues I have it. But those two sources will give you a safe base to work from.


@frankk Can you expand further on what is problematic in [B. Analayo's] viewpoint? I haven't fully delved into his work, but from what I have seen, it has been extremely well-put and well-founded.
I had no intention to contradict your answer. Merely to add. In my personal practice I read from Thai Ajahns, including Ajahn Geoff, but I can see how others would find it dense at first.

Could you also comment our your qualms with Thanissaro Bhikku "Right Mindfulness"? I'm very interested to hear your viewpoint


 With B. Analayo, his views on sati tend to stray a little too close or outright agree with some of the serious modern misconceptions and misunderstandings about what 'sati' is. Ideas such as, "choiceless awareness", "bare present moment awareness", "mindfulness is broad, jhana is 'one pointed'", "sati is non judgemental", etc. Much of his analysis written in his books is straightforward interpretation of suttas, no problem with that, but in some important areas to justify his misinterpretation of sati, he'll make some really nonsensical illogical reading of a sutta passage to justify his interpretation.

My disagreement with B. Thanissaro has to do with his interpretation of Dhamma in the 7sb awakening factors, and Dhamma anupassana as the 4th of the 4sp satipatthanas. I've written about it here on lucid24.org:

Meaning of the cryptic 4sp🐘 formula

He abides, continuously seeing the body as a body, [as it actually is, according to reality]...
He abides, continuously seeing the experienced-sensations as experienced-sensations, [as it actually is, according to reality]...
He abides, continuously seeing the mind as mind, [as it actually is, according to reality]...
He abides, continuously seeing the ☸Dhamma as ☸Dhamma, [as it actually is, according to reality]...
🔗proof & details


In contrast, most people interpret the 4sp formula to mean:
1. he contemplates a body meditation subject among many body meditation subjects to choose from...
2. he contemplates a feelings meditation subject among many feelings meditation subjects to choose from...
3. he contemplates a 'mind' meditation subject among many 'mind' meditation subjects to choose from...
4. he contemplates a 'phenomena' meditation subject among many 'phenomena' meditation subjects to choose from...



http://lucid24.org/sted/8aam/7sati/index.html


Also on the blog, if you search between 2019 nov and may, I've written several articles on how 'Dhamma' should be left untranslated because it often straddles several meanings. In the English translations of B. Bodhi and B. Thanissaro, by translating 'dhamma'  in the 7sb awakening factor and 4th frame of satipatthana (Phenomena, qualities, mental qualities, etc.) is highly problematic. This is not really their fault, it's because they regard MN 10 and DN 22 as the authoritative interpretation of sati, and those two suttas were distorted by late Theravada Abhidhamma biases.


Monday, November 25, 2019

relationship between sati, iddhipada, arahantship


Re: Can you develop Iddhipada by Satipathana?

Post by frank k » Mon Nov 25, 2019 7:40 am
You need sati developing any path factor. The 4sp satipatthana are the nimittas/signs of samadhi. The 4ip iddhipada, all have 'samadhi' embedded in their formula. And the 4 types of ip, if you study those words carefully, the first 2 figure prominently in the right effort formula (chanda, virya). So in a sense, the 4ip are describing how right effort and right sati are developed to produce right samadhi. If you compare the 4ip extended formula with AN 6.29 and AN 5.28, by studying the role of the development of luminosity for knowledge and vision, and the lack of piti and sukha mentioned in the 4ip, and the easy accessability of the 6 abhinna from developing 4ip, then it becomes clear the 4ip are ways to purify a fourth jhana to the point of being able to attain 6 abhinna. And since the destruction of the asavas (the 6th abhinna) is arahantship, then this is why the Buddha in the SN 51 iddhipada suttas say that all brahmans, ascetics, etc, that have become arahants who did so by means of 4ip.


SarathW wrote: 
Wed Nov 20, 2019 4:43 pm
Can you develop Iddhipada by Satipathana?
If yes, how?

Four bases of magical/mental/supernatural power (cattāro iddhipādā)[edit]
1.Will (chanda, S. chanda)
2.Energy (viriya, S. vīrya)
3.Consciousness (citta, S. citta)
4.Examination (vīmaṁsa or vīmaŋsā, S. mimāṃsā

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bodhipakk ... hamm%C4%81


Monday, November 18, 2019

how to avoid indulging in pleasure of hot showers

interesting question from
https://buddhism.stackexchange.com/questions/35973/pleasure-in-shower/35995#35995


Q:
I follow Yuttadhammo's tradition and I wanted to know how to prevent the pleasure I get in taking showers. Everytime I take them, I have a clinging to the warmth of the water and the feeling of it.
How do I prevent this or come to disattach from the experiences I have in showering and getting pleasure from it?
the-buddha traditions tipitaka personal-experienceshareeditflagasked yesterday
Dhamma4All


you may be under dressed, insufficiently warm all the times you're not in a comfortable hot shower. Wear more layers, keep your body warm, do enough cardiovascular and other physical exercises everyday (at least 30min) to improve your base body temperature and overall physical health. Then when you step in a hot shower, it won't feel like anything especially comfortable. When your reserve energy is strong, you feel like you could eat or not eat, sleep or not sleep, get a massage or a hot shower and it will just feel neutral, nothing special. But if you lack nutrients, you will be ravenously hungry, you lack body heat, hot showers will feel great, if you lack good circulation, a massage and hot shower will feel great, etc.

On the mental cultivation side of things, develop kusala habits to replace akusala habits. Before I take a shower, I resolve to not waste water, get in and out quickly just to get the job done. Probably that's less than 1 minute of water running, 3-4 minutes of rubbing, drying, etc. Also, there's no need to lather a thick layer of soap everywhere on the body, or even a thin layer. You just need to make sure to use enough soap on the areas that actually need it, and this way you don't dry out your skin and nutrients in the skin. Once you form good habits, it just becomes automatic and you don't even have to think or fight temptation. And if you take care of the physical health aspect as described above, your health will be robust enough where you don't even feel temptation of the pleasure of hot showers.

Wednesday, October 23, 2019

SN 16.5 Enlightened Arahant Maha Kassapa keeping strict rules to set a good example for future generations



SN 16.5  Enlightened Arahant Maha Kassapa keeping strict rules to set a good example for future generations


5. Jiṇṇasutta
5. Old Age
Evaṃ me sutaṃ …
So I have heard.
rājagahe veḷuvane.
Near Rājagaha, in the Bamboo Grove.
Atha kho āyasmā mahākassapo yena bhagavā tenupasaṅkami; upasaṅkamitvā bhagavantaṃ abhivādetvā ekamantaṃ nisīdi. Ekamantaṃ nisinnaṃ kho āyasmantaṃ mahākassapaṃ bhagavā etadavoca:
Then Venerable Mahākassapa went up to the Buddha, bowed, and sat down to one side. The Buddha said to him:
“jiṇṇosi dāni tvaṃ, kassapa, garukāni ca te imāni sāṇāni paṃsukūlāni nibbasanāni.
“You’re old now, Kassapa. Those worn-out hempen rag robes must be a burden for you.
Tasmātiha tvaṃ, kassapa, gahapatāni ceva cīvarāni dhārehi, nimantanāni ca bhuñjāhi, mama ca santike viharāhī”ti.
So Kassapa, you should wear clothes given by householders, accept invitations for the meal, and stay in my presence.”
“Ahaṃ kho, bhante, dīgharattaṃ āraññiko ceva āraññikattassa ca vaṇṇavādī, piṇḍapātiko ceva piṇḍapātikattassa ca vaṇṇavādī, paṃsukūliko ceva paṃsukūlikattassa ca vaṇṇavādī, tecīvariko ceva tecīvarikattassa ca vaṇṇavādī, appiccho ceva appicchatāya ca vaṇṇavādī, santuṭṭho ceva santuṭṭhiyā ca vaṇṇavādī, pavivitto ceva pavivekassa ca vaṇṇavādī, asaṃsaṭṭho ceva asaṃsaggassa ca vaṇṇavādī, āraddhavīriyo ceva vīriyārambhassa ca vaṇṇavādī”ti.
“For a long time, sir, I’ve lived in the wilderness, eaten only alms-food, worn rag robes, and owned just three robes; and I’ve praised these things. I’ve been one of few wishes, content, secluded, aloof, and energetic; and I’ve praised these things.”
“Kiṃ pana tvaṃ, kassapa, atthavasaṃ sampassamāno dīgharattaṃ āraññiko ceva āraññikattassa ca vaṇṇavādī, piṇḍapātiko ceva … pe …
“But seeing what benefit, Kassapa, have you long practiced these things?”
paṃsukūliko ceva …
tecīvariko ceva …
appiccho ceva …
santuṭṭho ceva …
pavivitto ceva …
asaṃsaṭṭho ceva …
āraddhavīriyo ceva vīriyārambhassa ca vaṇṇavādī”ti?
“Dve khvāhaṃ, bhante, atthavase sampassamāno dīgharattaṃ āraññiko ceva āraññikattassa ca vaṇṇavādī, piṇḍapātiko ceva … pe …
“Sir, seeing two benefits I have long practiced these things.
paṃsukūliko ceva …
tecīvariko ceva …
appiccho ceva …
santuṭṭho ceva …
pavivitto ceva …
asaṃsaṭṭho ceva …
āraddhavīriyo ceva vīriyārambhassa ca vaṇṇavādī.
Attano ca diṭṭhadhammasukhavihāraṃ sampassamāno, pacchimañca janataṃ anukampamāno:
I see a happy life for myself in the present. And I have compassion for future generations, thinking:
‘appeva nāma pacchimā janatā diṭṭhānugatiṃ āpajjeyyuṃ.
‘Hopefully those who come after might follow my example.’
Ye kira te ahesuṃ buddhānubuddhasāvakā te dīgharattaṃ āraññikā ceva ahesuṃ āraññikattassa ca vaṇṇavādino … pe …
For they may think: ‘It seems that the awakened disciples of the Buddha for a long time lived in the wilderness, ate only alms-food, wore rag robes, and owned just three robes; and they praised these things. They were of few wishes, content, secluded, aloof, and energetic; and they praised these things.’
piṇḍapātikā ceva ahesuṃ … pe …
paṃsukūlikā ceva ahesuṃ …
tecīvarikā ceva ahesuṃ …
appicchā ceva ahesuṃ …
santuṭṭhā ceva ahesuṃ …
pavivittā ceva ahesuṃ …
asaṃsaṭṭhā ceva ahesuṃ …
āraddhavīriyā ceva ahesuṃ vīriyārambhassa ca vaṇṇavādino’ti.
Te tathattāya paṭipajjissanti, tesaṃ taṃ bhavissati dīgharattaṃ hitāya sukhāya.
They’ll practice accordingly, which will be for their lasting welfare and happiness.
Ime khvāhaṃ, bhante, dve atthavase sampassamāno dīgharattaṃ āraññiko ceva āraññikattassa ca vaṇṇavādī, piṇḍapātiko ceva … pe …
Seeing these two benefits I have long practiced these things.”
paṃsukūliko ceva …
tecīvariko ceva …
appiccho ceva …
santuṭṭho ceva …
pavivitto ceva …
asaṃsaṭṭho ceva …
āraddhavīriyo ceva vīriyārambhassa ca vaṇṇavādī”ti.
“Sādhu sādhu, kassapa.
“Good, good, Kassapa!
Bahujanahitāya kira tvaṃ, kassapa, paṭipanno bahujanasukhāya lokānukampāya atthāya hitāya sukhāya devamanussānaṃ.
You’re acting for the welfare and happiness of the people, for the benefit, welfare, and happiness of gods and humans.
Tasmātiha tvaṃ, kassapa, sāṇāni ceva paṃsukūlāni dhārehi nibbasanāni, piṇḍāya ca carāhi, araññe ca viharāhī”ti.
So Kassapa, wear worn-out hempen rag robes, walk for alms, and stay in the wilderness.”


SN 16.13 lax vinaya leads to declide of true Dharma

13. Saddhammappatirūpakasutta
13. The Counterfeit of the True Teaching
Evaṃ me sutaṃ—
So I have heard.
ekaṃ samayaṃ bhagavā sāvatthiyaṃ viharati jetavane anāthapiṇḍikassa ārāme.
At one time the Buddha was staying near Sāvatthī in Jeta’s Grove, Anāthapiṇḍika’s monastery.
Atha kho āyasmā mahākassapo yena bhagavā tenupasaṅkami; upasaṅkamitvā bhagavantaṃ abhivādetvā ekamantaṃ nisīdi. Ekamantaṃ nisinno kho āyasmā mahākassapo bhagavantaṃ etadavoca:
Then Venerable Mahākassapa went up to the Buddha, bowed, sat down to one side, and said to him:
“ko nu kho, bhante, hetu ko paccayo, yena pubbe appatarāni ceva sikkhāpadāni ahesuṃ bahutarā ca bhikkhū aññāya saṇṭhahiṃsu?
“What is the cause, sir, what is the reason why there used to be fewer training rules but more enlightened monks?
Ko pana, bhante, hetu ko paccayo, yenetarahi bahutarāni ceva sikkhāpadāni appatarā ca bhikkhū aññāya saṇṭhahantī”ti?
And what is the cause, what is the reason why these days there are more training rules and fewer enlightened monks?”
“Evañcetaṃ, kassapa, hoti sattesu hāyamānesu saddhamme antaradhāyamāne, bahutarāni ceva sikkhāpadāni honti appatarā ca bhikkhū aññāya saṇṭhahanti.
“That’s how it is, Kassapa. When sentient beings are in decline and the true teaching is disappearing there are more training rules and fewer enlightened monks.
Na tāva, kassapa, saddhammassa antaradhānaṃ hoti yāva na saddhammappatirūpakaṃ loke uppajjati.
The true teaching doesn’t disappear as long the counterfeit of the true teaching hasn’t appeared in the world.
Yato ca kho, kassapa, saddhammappatirūpakaṃ loke uppajjati, atha saddhammassa antaradhānaṃ hoti.
But when the counterfeit of the true teaching appears in the world then the true teaching disappears.
Seyyathāpi, kassapa, na tāva jātarūpassa antaradhānaṃ hoti yāva na jātarūpappatirūpakaṃ loke uppajjati.
It’s like true gold, which doesn’t disappear as long as counterfeit gold hasn’t appeared in the world.
Yato ca kho, kassapa, jātarūpappatirūpakaṃ loke uppajjati, atha kho jātarūpassa antaradhānaṃ hoti.
But when counterfeit gold appears in the world then real gold disappears.
Evameva kho, kassapa, na tāva saddhammassa antaradhānaṃ hoti yāva na saddhammappatirūpakaṃ loke uppajjati.
In the same way, the true teaching doesn’t disappear as long the counterfeit of the true teaching hasn’t appeared in the world.
Yato ca kho, kassapa, saddhammappatirūpakaṃ loke uppajjati, atha saddhammassa antaradhānaṃ hoti.
But when the counterfeit of the true teaching appears in the world then the true teaching disappears.
Na kho, kassapa, pathavīdhātu saddhammaṃ antaradhāpeti, na āpodhātu saddhammaṃ antaradhāpeti, na tejodhātu saddhammaṃ antaradhāpeti, na vāyodhātu saddhammaṃ antaradhāpeti;
It’s not the elements of earth, water, fire, or air that make the true teaching disappear.
atha kho idheva te uppajjanti moghapurisā ye imaṃ saddhammaṃ antaradhāpenti.
Rather, it’s the foolish people who appear right here that make the true teaching disappear.
Seyyathāpi, kassapa, nāvā ādikeneva opilavati;
The true teaching doesn’t disappear like a ship that sinks all at once.
na kho, kassapa, evaṃ saddhammassa antaradhānaṃ hoti.
Pañca khome, kassapa, okkamaniyā dhammā saddhammassa sammosāya antaradhānāya saṃvattanti.
There are five detrimental things that lead to the decline and disappearance of the true teaching.
Katame pañca?
What five?
Idha, kassapa, bhikkhū bhikkhuniyo upāsakā upāsikāyo satthari agāravā viharanti appatissā, dhamme agāravā viharanti appatissā, saṅghe agāravā viharanti appatissā, sikkhāya agāravā viharanti appatissā, samādhismiṃ agāravā viharanti appatissā—
It’s when the monks, nuns, laymen, and laywomen lack respect and reverence for the Teacher, the teaching, the Saṅgha, the training, and undistractible-lucidity.
ime kho, kassapa, pañca okkamaniyā dhammā saddhammassa sammosāya antaradhānāya saṃvattanti.
These five detrimental things lead to the decline and disappearance of the true teaching.
Pañca khome, kassapa, dhammā saddhammassa ṭhitiyā asammosāya anantaradhānāya saṃvattanti.
There are five things that lead to the continuation, persistence, and enduring of the true teaching.
Katame pañca?
What five?
Idha, kassapa, bhikkhū bhikkhuniyo upāsakā upāsikāyo satthari sagāravā viharanti sappatissā, dhamme sagāravā viharanti sappatissā, saṅghe sagāravā viharanti sappatissā, sikkhāya sagāravā viharanti sappatissā, samādhismiṃ sagāravā viharanti sappatissā—
It’s when the monks, nuns, laymen, and laywomen maintain respect and reverence for the Teacher, the teaching, the Saṅgha, the training, and undistractible-lucidity.
ime kho, kassapa, pañca dhammā saddhammassa ṭhitiyā asammosāya anantaradhānāya saṃvattantī”ti.
These five things lead to the continuation, persistence, and enduring of the true teaching.”

Wednesday, October 16, 2019

A Buddhist monk (Dalai lama) hugging an American nun.


image
His Holiness the Dalai Lama and Venerable Thubten Chodron
“His Holiness the Dalai Lama and Ven. Thubten Chodron continue to give generously to the Buddhist community, and in particular to the community of Western Buddhist practitioners. This fourth volume in the magnificent Library of Wisdom and Compassion maintains the high standards set in the first three: it is comprehensive without sacrificing relevant detail, it is precise without sacrificing accessibility, and it is of enormous value to practitioners and teachers but still of great interest to scholars of Buddhism.”
—Jay L. Garfield, Doris Silbert Professor in the Humanities, Smith College and the Harvard Divinity School

The Library of Wisdom and Compassion is a special multivolume series in which His Holiness the Dalai Lama shares the Buddha’s teachings on the complete path to full awakening that he himself has practiced his entire life. The topics are arranged especially for people seeking practical spiritual advice and are peppered with the Dalai Lama’s own unique outlook. Assisted by his long-term disciple, the American nun Thubten Chodron, the Dalai Lama sets the context for practicing the Buddha’s teachings in modern times and then unveils the path of wisdom and compassion that leads to a meaningful life and sense of personal fulfillment. This series is an important bridge from introductory to profound topics for those seeking an in-depth explanation from a contemporary perspective.
If you’re a member of the Wisdom Experience you can read many of the volumes in The Library of Wisdom and Compassion now in the Reading Room, and we’re working on getting the rest added. 

Re: B.sujato translates 'metta' as 'love'. That's horrible, and it's wrong.

Post by frank k » Wed Oct 16, 2019 6:10 am
Nicolas wrote: 
Mon Jul 22, 2019 3:08 am
What about “universal love”?
As a translation for 'metta', 'universal love' is better than 'loving kindness', but still problematic.
B. Sujato's translation of 'metta' as 'love' is beyond problematic and wrong, it's horrible.
Here's an example of why.

Buddhist monk (Dalai lama) hugging an American nun.
https://notesonthedhamma.blogspot.com/2 ... ging.html

Lots of skin to skin contact here as far as I can tell from the picture.
Too much 'loving-kindness' here (Dalai lama's usual translation for 'metta').


Re: A Buddhist monk (Dalai lama) hugging an American nun.

Post by Bhikkhu Pesala » Mon Oct 21, 2019 9:31 pm
  1. It is an offence of formal meeting to touch a woman with lustful intent.
  2. It is an offence of wrong-doing to touch a woman with affection. The behaviour of the Dalai Lama seems to be an offence under this rule, but not knowing his mind with my mind, I am not qualified to say that he has affection in his mind. Perhaps he is just following the social convention and has only mettā. One could liken it to shaking hands with a woman in the West to avoid making them feel uncomfortable. I don't usually shake hands with women, but try to explain the right way to greet a monk.
  3. There is no offence to touch a woman to rescue her from danger.† Catching an elderly woman to prevent her falling or pulling a woman out of a river to prevent her drowning is not usually done with any unwholesome mental states, though the mind can change quickly.
  4. Again, if a woman grabs a monk with lustful intent or for some other reason, there is no offence for the monk unless he prolongs the contact to enjoy it with lustful or affectionate intent.
Buddhist Monastic Code wrote:The Vibhaṅga does not discuss the issue of bhikkhus who intentionally make active contact with women for purposes other than lust or affection — e.g., helping a woman who has fallen into a raging river — but the Commentary does. It introduces the concept of anāmasa, things carrying a Dukkaṭa penalty when touched; women and clothing belonging to a woman top the list. It then goes into great detail to tell how one should behave when one’s mother falls into a raging river. Under no circumstances, it says, should one grab hold of her, although one may extend a rope, a board, etc., in her direction. If she happens to grab hold of her son the bhikkhu, he should not shake her off, but should simply let her hold on as he swims back to shore.
Where the Commentary gets the concepts of anāmasa is hard to say. Perhaps it came from the practices of the Brahmin caste, who are very careful not to touch certain things and people of certain lower castes. At any rate, there is no direct basis for it in the Canon. Although the concept has received universal acceptance in Theravādin Communities, many highly‑respected Vinaya experts have made an exception right here, saying that there is nothing wrong in touching a woman when one’s action is based not on lust, but on a desire to save her from danger.†


Post by frank k » Tue Oct 22, 2019 5:14 am
Thanks Venerable Pesala. I'm also hoping people can contribute links to previously written articles that can help explain that strict rules serve important purposes, and that 'skillful means' and 'crazy wisdom' are usually just rationalizations to commit crimes of passion. I'm sure it's well covered territory and many people in the past have explained it clearly and in detail. It would be good to collect them as a resource for future generations to study.

Dan74 wrote: 
Mon Oct 21, 2019 12:17 pm
frank k,

I think you are drawing a very long bow by linking sex scandals in Tibetan and Mahayana Buddhism to more relaxed rules on hugging. The people involved in sex scandals by and large were not monks, so the Vinaya was irrelevant. But logically I don't find the connection plausible. Rather the causes lie elsewhere.
I think the correlation is very clear and undeniable.
Let's compare two traditions. Ajahn Chah's forest monk lineage, which follows Theravada vinaya rules strictly.
Have there any even been any sex scandals in that lineage?
If monks had difficulty with lust that they couldn't overcome, they always have the option to disrobe, and return to the lay life.
In the early days of the Buddha's dispensation, all or most of the monks were arahants, fully awakened, and there was no vinaya or rules.
The rules are there are the unawakened, they were carefully crafted for specific purposes, and they work well, as long as disciples follow them.

There's no rationalizing 'skillful means' (Mahayana) or 'crazy wisdom' (tibetan buddhism) to justify coarse sensual pleasures of sex, no matter what flavor of Buddhism anyone follows. The prohibition in the Theravada vinaya from hugging and having any physical contact, gives clear cut concrete rules to ensure physical sexual abuse can't happen. Regardless of whether the Tibetan lamas or Mahayana bodhisattva aspirants partially or don't follow the vinaya (where Bodhisattva vows and 'skillful means' can trump the vinaya seemingly whenever it's convenient for them), fundamentally indulgence in sensual pleasures are unskillful qualities, and any kind of physical contact that can encourage it is obviously a potential problem, especially with unenlightened beings.

Just look at some of the samples you can find easily from the Mahayana and Tibetan Buddhist world. Even though some of them are not bound by the vinaya, their behavior is far off any kind of ethical human behavior. Even the non-celibate have ethical standards. Had they been following the vinaya, then at least there would be clear cut rules obvious to everyone whether they were behaving within rules.

https://www.independent.co.uk/arts-ente ... 9859.html

https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/7319165/c ... -dakinis/

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/ ... k-secrets

That's just a tiny sampling of sexual abuse among the non vinaya followers.



Re: A Buddhist monk (Dalai lama) hugging an American nun.

Post by frank k » Sat Oct 26, 2019 6:51 am
Dan74 wrote: 
Fri Oct 25, 2019 2:24 am

Your argument that the behaviour like the Dalai Lama's above leads to sex scandals is patent nonsense. And yes, I will stop wasting my time trying to reason with someone who is wilfully blind.
I was hoping the community could provide more articles that addressed this issues, or ones similar to this, on why basic vinaya rules are so important. I don't want to restate and rehash what has already been eloquently explained many times throughout history.

But until they do, I'll have to spend hopefully not too much time to point out the obvious and spell it out for those of you who don't see the problem with monks hugging women (platonically).

I never argued that hugging leads to sex scandals. I hardly said anything at all in the original blog post, I thought the picture and bare description alone was enough for those who have eyes and basic ability to think and understand ethics could see potential problems.

The Buddha taught for 45 years, and had a vinaya, a code of discipline for monastics, developed and refined over that long period of time. Many of the rules are minor. But the major rules are really important, and they are there exactly as they are, for important reasons.

One of those rules, which the Dalai Lama is not following in the photograph, prohibits intentional physical contact such as hugging (accidentally bumping into a woman is not an offense) between monks and any woman, even their mom or sister.

1. Why not even their mom, sister, or grandmother, or daughter?

Because the rest of the world probably doesn't know that woman is their relative.
They don't know whether the hug is platonic or romantic.

2. A timeless principle is that people learn not just from hearing and thinking about teachings, but probably much more from modeling, following living examples of their teachers and fellow students. Even if the teacher is enlightened and can hug anyone platonically without lust, their students are not. Having special rules for different classes of people complicates things, so they're avoided as much as possible. Enlightened teachers observe their own strict rules to set a good example, not because they personally need them.

So if the Mahayana and Tibetan Buddhist teachers followed the Buddha's rule of not having any physical contact between monastics of the opposite sex, then these things would not have happened, or if they did happened, it would be clear to both the perpetrators and the victims that what was going on was illicit and prohibited.

3. Have you forgotten what its like to be in puberty with raging hormones?
If you have forgotten, just look at dogs and animals in the wild when it's mating season. What do you think it's like for monastics who ordain young? Why do muslim women wear hijab to veil their face? As a college muslim (male) friend attending a decadent American university in the springtime when the weather was warm and beautiful once told me,
"I love America. Where I'm from, when you look at young women, there's nothing to see, it's like looking at a tent."
Some real examples:
1. SANGHARAKSHITA raping hetersexual men, some of them underage (age of consent for homosexual sex), all of them believing it was spiritual friendship and a blessing for spiritual empowerment and not a sick rapist preying on innocent kids he lied to. If no hugging and physical contact was even allowed, then how can this happen? It would be obvious to victims what is inappropriate and illicit behavior. Hugging on its own is not the cause of sexual crime, but prohibiting hugging can prevent or deter victims from being lied to.

https://buddhism-controversy-blog.com/2 ... al-abuse/


I could go on for pages and pages. Chogyam Rinpoche. And some of this students like this one:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C3%96sel_Tendzin
It was revealed in 1989 that Ösel Tendzin had contracted HIV and for nearly three years knew it, yet continued to have unsafe sex with his students without informing them.[15][16] He transmitted it to a student who later died of AIDS.[17][18][19] Others close to Tendzin, including the board of directors of Vajradhatu, knew for two years that Tendzin was HIV-positive and sexually active but kept silent.[20] As one student reported at the time,

I was very distressed that he and his entourage had lied to us for so long, always saying he did not have AIDS. I was even more distressed over the stories of how the Regent used his position as a dharma teacher to induce "straight" students to have unprotected sex with him, while he claimed he had been tested for AIDS but the result was negative.[11]

Stephen Butterfield, a former student, recounted in a memoir:

Tenzin offered to explain his behavior at a meeting which I attended. Like all of his talks, this was considered a teaching of dharma, and donations were solicited and expected. So I paid him $35.00 to hear his explanation. In response to close questioning by students, he first swore us to secrecy (family secrets again), and then said that Trungpa had requested him to be tested for HIV in the early 1980s and told him to keep quiet about the positive result. Tendzin had asked Trungpa what he should do if students wanted to have sex with him, and Trungpa's reply was that as long as he did his Vajrayana purification practices, it did not matter, because they would not get the disease. Tendzin's answer, in short, was that he had obeyed the guru.[21]
If they followed the Buddha's rules on no hugging, then how can this kind of tragedy happen?