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Why the fuss over LBT and EBT versions of jhāna? Aren't they both 99% Buddha's definition?

(I will expand on this discussion later, but this is just a copy of a discussion between Frank and Sarath)

 


frank k wrote: ↑Thu Apr 27, 2023 2:42 am
SarathW wrote: ↑Mon Jan 15, 2018 1:35 pmThe real question is whether the teaching of Abhidhamma and Visuddhi Magga contain the Buddha's teaching.
My understanding is they both contain Buddha's teaching. (say 99%)
This is no difference to Sutta. Even Sutta does not have 100% representation of what Buddha taught.
I think those monks who discourage their student to study Abhidhamma and Visuddhi Magga are irresponsible.
Even if Ab and Vism. were 99.999% correct, if that 0.001 is wrong in a critical part of core,
it corrupts the entire Dhamma.

Those corruptions in Vism. are not trivial.
they do great harm, have done great harm, continue to do great harm.
https://lucid24.org/sted/8aam/8samadhi/ ... index.html

Vism. redefintion of jhāna doesn't even agree with Ab Vibhanga jhāna!
Ab Vb understands vitakka and vicāra correctly in agreement with EBT.



frank k wrote: ↑Sat Apr 29, 2023 8:56 am

SarathW wrote: ↑Fri Apr 28, 2023 1:05 pm...
What I said was compared with more than one definition.
If you access only one definition that killing someone is the way to union with God then you are a very unfortunate person.
Then again if you do not have the very basic ethics they that also very unfortunate.

You're making an impossible assumption.
If you start off with Vism.'s wrong definition of jhāna,
when you do a real BUddha's jhāna, you're still striving for doing a wrong jhāna, not realizing you've already landed on the Buddha's jhāna continuum.

This has happened to me, and lots of people.
It's tragic, and totally preventable.
But only if wrong viewers acknowledge the truth, confess their errors, and start teaching the right way to jhāna.

When you and others continue being apologists and prioritizing harmony instead of giving truth the proper care it deserves, you are enabling criminal behavior and allowing this horrible crime to continue.

I'm not against harmony, just not at the cost of truth and justice.
Just like we can live harmoniously with christians, muslims.
And Buddha's EBT jhāna practitioners can live in harmony with LBT Vism. redefined "jhāna" practitioners,
but only if the LBT heretics acknowledge their crimes and admit their redefined 'jhāna' is different than the Buddha's EBT jhāna.



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