cetaso ekodibhāva, "unification" is not a good translation

Re: cetaso ekodibhāva

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Post by frank k » Wed May 22, 2019 6:54 am

Kumara wrote: ↑

Tue May 21, 2019 8:11 pm

Dear venerables and friend,

This term has been widely translated as "unification of mind". I
thought that's okay, until I thought about what "unify" mean. It's to
combine two or more units to make one.

But the citta is already one. We don't have multiple cittas. So how
can we unify one thing?

Does anyone have a better choice for this?

Dear Ven.,

I did a detailed study here, including all sutta occurrences of ekodi in EBT.

http://lucid24.org/sted/8aam/8samadhi/e ... ndex.html

MN 122 and MN 20 in particular really show how ekodi-bhava acts as a verb to get samadhi by doing four jhanas

I treat the ekaggata citta and ekodi-bhava as pretty synonymous.

I translate ekagga as "single preoccupation"

and ekodi = singular, ekodi-bhava = has become singular

since ekagga citta and "samadhi" are also nearly synonymous in many contexts,

and I have samadhi = "undistractible lucidity", (not able to distract from the focus on a single preoccupation)

then all 3 terms ekodi, ekagga citta, samadhi match up, as they should.

ekodi: "unification" is not a good translation for that

example:

Re: cetaso ekodibhāva

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Post by Kumara » Thu May 23, 2019 1:27 am

Thanks to all for participating. I still have a problem with "unified" for ekodi. See this from Bhikkhu Bodhi's translation of the Suttanipāta (p318)

962. “Having taken up what training,
dwelling unified, judicious, mindful,
should he blow away his own stains
as a smith [removes the flaws] of silver?” (8)

translated from
“kaṁ so sikkhaṁ samādāya, ekodi nipako sato.
kammāro rajatasseva, niddhame malamattano”.

Frankk comment:

I agree with Ven. Kumara. "Unified" is a vague word here that doesn't really convey what to do, doesn't give any kind of hint of connection to samadhi. 

But using any single word potentially has the same limitation, and the passage above is a short verse which tend to inherently be terse and not easy to unpack for those not broadly learned in suttas. 

My solution would be to add parenthetical clarification, such as: "unified [in samādhi]". 

So what do translators mean by "unification"? 

I think this sutta explains it best:

AN 5.51 āvaraṇa-suttaṃ

• 
  
• (under influence of 5niv, monk can’t see clearly)
• (simile of river getting split and losing power)
• (repeat: under influence of 5niv, monk can’t see clearly)
• (monk NOT under influence of 5niv can know and see)
• (simile: undispersed river is mighty)
• (repeat: monk NOT under influence of 5niv can know and see)
• (end of sutta)

(simile of river getting split and losing power)

seyyathāpi,bhikkhave,	"Suppose, monks,
nadī pabbateyyā dūraṅ-gamā	(a) river from-the-mountain, far-(it)-goes,
sīgha-sotā	(whose) strift-stream
hāra-hārinī.	carries-and-carries-away-rapidly [everything with it].
tassā puriso	a man,
ubhato naṅgala-mukhāni	(to) both [sides] plough-channels
vivareyya.	(that) should-open (it up).
evañhi so, bhikkhave,	thus-indeed that, **********,
majjhe nadiyā soto	middle (of the) river current
vikkhitto visaṭo byādiṇṇo	(is) dispersed, diffused, dissipated;
n'eva dūraṅ-gamo assa	surely-not (a) [far] distance-going water,
na sīgha-soto	not (a) swift-stream [of current],
na hāra-hārī.	(it) doesn't carry-and-carry-away-rapidly [everything with it].

(repeat: under influence of 5niv, monk can’t see clearly)

evamevaṃ kho,bhikkhave,	Just like that, monks,
so vata bhikkhu	when a monk,
ime pañca āvaraṇe nīvaraṇe	his five obstacles (and) hindrances
cetaso ajjhāruhe	(that the) mind (is) overcome (by),
paññāya dubbalīkaraṇe	(that his) wisdom (is) weakened (by)
ap-pahāya,	(are) not-abandoned,
a-balāya paññāya dubbalāya	(when he is) without-power (and) wisdom weak,
att'-atthaṃ vā ñassati	(that he) {understands} (what is for) his-own-benefit,
par'-atthaṃ vā ñassati	(that he) {understands} (what is for) other's-benefit,
ubhay'-atthaṃ vā ñassati	(that he) {understands} (what is for) both-[parties']-benefit,
uttari vā manussa-dhammā	(for a) superior ** human-state,
alam-ariya-ñāṇa-dassana-visesaṃ	(a) truly-noble-knowledge-(and)-vision-distinction,
sacchi-karissatīti	[that he] would-realize (this),
n'etaṃ ṭhānaṃ vijjati.	[there is] no'[way]-this condition happens.

(monk NOT under influence of 5niv can know and see)

“so vata, Bhikkhave, bhikkhu	“when a, ***********, monk,
ime pañca āvaraṇe nīvaraṇe	his five obstacles (and) hindrances
cetaso ajjhāruhe	(that the) mind (is) overcome (by),
paññāya dubbalīkaraṇe	(that his) wisdom (is) weakened (by)
pahāya,	(having) abandoned (them),
balavatiyā paññāya	(with) power (and) wisdom,
att'-atthaṃ vā ñassati	(that he) {understands} (what is for) his-own-benefit,
par'-atthaṃ vā ñassati	(that he) {understands} (what is for) other's-benefit,
ubhay'-atthaṃ vā ñassati	(that he) {understands} (what is for) both-[parties']-benefit,
uttari vā manussa-dhammā	(for a) superior ** human-state,
alam-ariya-ñāṇa-dassana-visesaṃ	(a) truly-noble-knowledge-(and)-vision-distinction,
sacchi-karissatīti	[that he] would-realize (this),
Ṭhānam-etaṃ vijjati.	{this}-condition (can) be-known.

(simile: undispersed river is mighty)

seyyathāpi, bhikkhave,	"Suppose, monks,
nadī pabbateyyā dūraṅ-gamā	(a) river from-the-mountain, far-(it)-goes,
Sīgha-sotā	its current swift,
hāra-hārinī.	carries-and-carries-away-rapidly [everything with it].
tassā puriso	a man,
ubhato naṅgala-mukhāni	(to) both [sides] plough-channels
pidaheyya.	(that) should-close (it up).
evañhi so, bhikkhave,	thus-indeed that, **********,
majjhe nadiyā soto	middle (of the) river current
A-vikkhitto a-visaṭo a-byādiṇṇo	(is) not-dispersed, not-diffused, not-dissipated,
Dūraṅ-gamo ceva assa	far-(it)-goes indeed, (that) water,
Sīgha-soto ca	(a) swift-stream [of current],
Hāra-hārī ca.	(it) carries-and-carries-away-rapidly [everything with it].