can you do metta and 4 jhanas simultaneously?

Re: Loving kindness (metta) and compassion

Post by frank k » Mon Jun 08, 2020 8:02 am

Dhammanando wrote: ↑
Mon Jun 08, 2020 7:34 am
confusedlayman wrote: ↑
Mon Jun 08, 2020 4:11 am
So one cant do metta radiation if he attained 1st jhana by breath or kasina?
Not while in the jhāna, but one could do it after emerging from it. Indeed that would be a particularly good time to do it, since it's normal for the mind to be "pure and bright, unblemished, free from defects, malleable, wieldy and steady" for some duration after emergence.

That's not how it works in EBT and earlier Theravada Abhidhamma. See the difference between how Vimutti magga and Visuddhi magga perform the 4bv brahma viharas.

In EBT and early Abhidhamma, you don't leave the 4bv to enter a frozen state (redefined "jhana") and then emerge from a frozen state to do 4bv. You do 4bv and 4 jhanas simultaneously.

(vimt. and vism passages here);
http://lucid24.org/sted/ebt/not/index.html

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AN 9.36, MN 64, MN 111: How does Ajahn Brahm and Sujato's "Jhāna" work here?

What these 3 suttas have in common, AN 9.36, MN 64, MN 111, is the very interesting feature of explicitly describing doing vipassana, while one is in the jhāna and the first 3 formless attainments. LBT (late buddhist text) apologists, as well as Sujato, Brahm, claim that the suttas describe a jhāna where one enters a disembodied, frozen state, where vipassana is impossible until one emerges from that 'jhāna'. Since Sujato translated all the suttas, let's take a look at what he translated, and how it supports his interpretation of 'jhāna'. AN 9.36: Jhānasutta—Bhikkhu Sujato (suttacentral.net) ‘The first absorption is a basis for ending the defilements.’ ‘Paṭhamampāhaṁ, bhikkhave, jhānaṁ nissāya āsavānaṁ khayaṁ vadāmī’ti, iti kho panetaṁ vuttaṁ. That’s what I said, but why did I say it? Kiñcetaṁ paṭicca vuttaṁ? Take a mendicant who, q uite secluded from sensual pleasures, secluded from unskill...

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'Viveka', Sanskrit dictionary Primary meaning is ‘discrimination’. Other meanings: (1) true knowledge, (2) discretion, (3) right judgement, (4) the faculty of distinguishing and classifying things according to their real properties’. Wikipedia (sanskrit dictionary entry 'viveka') Viveka (Sanskrit: विवेक, romanized: viveka) is a Sanskrit and Pali term translated into English as discernment or discrimination.[1] According to Rao and Paranjpe, viveka can be explained more fully as: Sense of discrimination; wisdom; discrimination between the real and the unreal, between the self and the non-self, between the permanent and the impermanent; discriminative inquiry; right intuitive discrimination; ever present discrimination between the transient and the permanent.[2]: 348 The Vivekachudamani is an eighth-century Sanskrit poem in dialogue form that addresses the development of viveka. Within the Vedanta tradition, there is also a concept of vichara which is one t...

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